Hey guys,
You guys have had some great answers for me and that only creates new questions. Now I have been thinking of air rifles. I have looked over a great many posts and done quite a few searches. I've been thinking about how to really get started shooting. There is no organized 3p program nearby and the weather is only getting colder so I'm thinking of shooting 3p (4p) in my basement. I'm only shooting for myself and to teach my kids. Would it make sense on a 1k budget to get a nicer ssp such as a fwb 601 or a super air or one of the diana 75s rather than get something like a Crosman Challenger and have to spend all the money on air tanks etc? I do have a 10lb co2 tank if that makes a difference, but it seems as though I would spend several hundred dollars on gassing up a pcp. I'm not sure that I care that much about the hassles of a ssp when I'm shooting prone if it's just me.
Thanks, Philip
ssp vs pcp
Moderators: pilkguns, Marcus, m1963
Re: ssp vs pcp
Phillip, I am getting older (68) but enjoy shooting just for the fun of it. I too recently went through the "cost of PCP" exercise and could not warm up to the cost vs results for informal shooting. Our situation is different in that I only shoot standing and shoot both in the garage (6 yards) and at the range (10y - 25 y).
What I have found is that with my Daisy 753 the process of the SSP charging stroke is somewhat relaxing and provides a mental break to the actual shooting process. I really enjoy the entire process.
I also shoot pistol with an IZH-46M and a Beeman P3. These are also SSP guns. I should also have mentioned that the effort has been somewhat of a plus for me in that it has seemed to improve my upper body strength.
I also have two CO2 guns, a Crosman 2260SE and a Crosman 2300S which I shoot at the same distances. The CO2 guns shoot well too but I tend to shoot faster because of the SSP break between each shot.
The Daisy Avanti 753 (SSP) and the Daisy Avanti 887 (CO2) are both excellent starter rifles. Both have Lothar Walther barrels and will stack pellets at 10M.
For me SSP was the better option of cost versus results for my very informal shooting needs.
Mike
What I have found is that with my Daisy 753 the process of the SSP charging stroke is somewhat relaxing and provides a mental break to the actual shooting process. I really enjoy the entire process.
I also shoot pistol with an IZH-46M and a Beeman P3. These are also SSP guns. I should also have mentioned that the effort has been somewhat of a plus for me in that it has seemed to improve my upper body strength.
I also have two CO2 guns, a Crosman 2260SE and a Crosman 2300S which I shoot at the same distances. The CO2 guns shoot well too but I tend to shoot faster because of the SSP break between each shot.
The Daisy Avanti 753 (SSP) and the Daisy Avanti 887 (CO2) are both excellent starter rifles. Both have Lothar Walther barrels and will stack pellets at 10M.
For me SSP was the better option of cost versus results for my very informal shooting needs.
Mike
pcw wrote:Hey guys,
You guys have had some great answers for me and that only creates new questions. Now I have been thinking of air rifles. I have looked over a great many posts and done quite a few searches. I've been thinking about how to really get started shooting. There is no organized 3p program nearby and the weather is only getting colder so I'm thinking of shooting 3p (4p) in my basement. I'm only shooting for myself and to teach my kids. Would it make sense on a 1k budget to get a nicer ssp such as a fwb 601 or a super air or one of the diana 75s rather than get something like a Crosman Challenger and have to spend all the money on air tanks etc? I do have a 10lb co2 tank if that makes a difference, but it seems as though I would spend several hundred dollars on gassing up a pcp. I'm not sure that I care that much about the hassles of a ssp when I'm shooting prone if it's just me.
Thanks, Philip
I own many SSP pistols and rifles (mostly FWB brand); I shoot them regularly and recommend them as very cost-effective and just as accurate as PCP. However, the SSP rifles have one huge drawback...and it's just this deficiency that will effect you...
You mentioned that you want to shoot position with SSP. That's a big pain...literally.
SSP is fine for pistols and standing rifle, but cocking that long lever while kneeling, sitting, and especially while lying prone can be quite hard. It's frankly impossible to work the lever without coming out of position unless you have the arm length of an orangutan. This might be OK for informal shooting sessions, but is not practical during a timed match. Not only will you run out of time breaking position for every shot, but you'll get tired much faster getting in and out of position so many, many times.
I should mention that the FWB 300 rifle I also shoot has such a relatively short and easily-cocked lever that I can shoot it in 3P or 4P without breaking position. FWB 300s are spring-powered and well-maintained used examples cost much less than SSP or PCP rifles. You might want to consider that approach.
In general, if you want to shoot position, do it with a CO2 or PCP gun.
You mentioned that you want to shoot position with SSP. That's a big pain...literally.
SSP is fine for pistols and standing rifle, but cocking that long lever while kneeling, sitting, and especially while lying prone can be quite hard. It's frankly impossible to work the lever without coming out of position unless you have the arm length of an orangutan. This might be OK for informal shooting sessions, but is not practical during a timed match. Not only will you run out of time breaking position for every shot, but you'll get tired much faster getting in and out of position so many, many times.
I should mention that the FWB 300 rifle I also shoot has such a relatively short and easily-cocked lever that I can shoot it in 3P or 4P without breaking position. FWB 300s are spring-powered and well-maintained used examples cost much less than SSP or PCP rifles. You might want to consider that approach.
In general, if you want to shoot position, do it with a CO2 or PCP gun.
And the cost of PCP (or at least from the refill side) is not that bad. I bought a ready-to-go 80cf tank from a dive shop for $90. You could get that down to ~$60 with a little savy shopping.
You're trading the effort (hassle) of cocking every shot for refilling the air tank once or twice a year (for ~$5 a pop).
You're trading the effort (hassle) of cocking every shot for refilling the air tank once or twice a year (for ~$5 a pop).
That would be a reasonable price
I have not found prices that low here in Indianapolis. A new 80 cu. ft. tank is about $125 and the associated attachments (yoke, hose, couplings, etc.) are an additional $100. When I compare that to CO2 costs is seems a bit high.
Between my rifle and pistol I get an average of 50 good shots per 12g CO2 cartridge. Their retail cost locally is $0.50 per cartridge. $225 dollars buys 450 cartridges times 50 shots which is 22,500 shots. I am not sure I will ever shoot this many pellets in my 10M guns. I guess it could always be sold in my estate auction :)
PCP is a very good technology but not cheap to use informally. CO2 and SSP more than adequately serve a very population of shooters.
Mike
Between my rifle and pistol I get an average of 50 good shots per 12g CO2 cartridge. Their retail cost locally is $0.50 per cartridge. $225 dollars buys 450 cartridges times 50 shots which is 22,500 shots. I am not sure I will ever shoot this many pellets in my 10M guns. I guess it could always be sold in my estate auction :)
PCP is a very good technology but not cheap to use informally. CO2 and SSP more than adequately serve a very population of shooters.
Mike
Brian M wrote:And the cost of PCP (or at least from the refill side) is not that bad. I bought a ready-to-go 80cf tank from a dive shop for $90. You could get that down to ~$60 with a little savy shopping.
You're trading the effort (hassle) of cocking every shot for refilling the air tank once or twice a year (for ~$5 a pop).
I bought a used tank first off (with 4 years left on hydro), not new.
Buy a tank with a K-valve (not DIN), and there's no adapter needed. All the rest (adapter, hose, whatever) should be included in the price of the rifle/pistol ~ I've never seen one that sold new without those necessary pieces.
But you can make an argument for whatever angle you believe in. I'm not for PCP, CO2, or SSP ~ they all have strengths and weaknesses. I'm just saying that getting into PCP doesn't NEED to be expensive. My total cost (outside of my pistol) to get into PCP was $90.
Buy a tank with a K-valve (not DIN), and there's no adapter needed. All the rest (adapter, hose, whatever) should be included in the price of the rifle/pistol ~ I've never seen one that sold new without those necessary pieces.
But you can make an argument for whatever angle you believe in. I'm not for PCP, CO2, or SSP ~ they all have strengths and weaknesses. I'm just saying that getting into PCP doesn't NEED to be expensive. My total cost (outside of my pistol) to get into PCP was $90.
