Returning to bullseye - having problems getting going though

Chris_D · Post by **Chris_D** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:05 pm

Hi shooters,

I just returned to shooting about 3 weeks ago after a 25 year "rest". I am still shooting my old guns
Smith model 41 with burris 2X
Smith model 52 with burris 2X

My first day out I shot pretty good with both guns 260s. Since then I have been degrading rapidly, now shooting 240s to 250s. Most of my problems are with the model 52 and I know it is recoil anticipation. Shots are generally high-right or right and this spans all three courses of fire.

When I dry fire I am rock solid, no movement other than normal arm sway. When I shoot my air pistol, I am pretty solid but of course that is all slow fire (Daisy model 717).

I am starting to recall most of the fundementals. My breathing is getting better, my stance is more consistant, my grip is getting stronger and more consistant, my trigger finger is not too bad in that it is controlled in dry fire. My timing for timed and rapid fire is really bad, I have no rythm yet.

I am just trying to figure out a way to break the problems I am having and can't seem to figure out a way just yet. I sure would appreciate some advice on how to break from the problems I am having.

THanks

Chris

marvelshooter · Post by **marvelshooter** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 8:09 pm

Chris,
I would say don't be too concerned after only three weeks. I don't know how long you shot before your layoff or what level you were but I will say that it takes years to get really good at this game. Yes there are people who are natural and don't have to work hard to be good but I think they are rare. So my advice is go shoot. A lot. And don't be discouraged early on.

waxman · Post by **waxman** » Sat Mar 26, 2011 9:39 pm

Agreed. After a few weeks you're already anticipating high scores that may take months or years to realize. Don't over-analyze.
Practice, but practice "good"- that is, find your best stance, grip, breathing pattern and trigger control that suits you now. Enjoy!
Forget scores. Shoot a ten, repeat.
John

Chris_D · Post by **Chris_D** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 7:37 am

Yes, you guys are probably right. I just need to settle down, get enough range time to get the feel again. I will be back at the range today and will have to focus on shooting and not overthinking everything. Perhaps I will just try to have fun. Part of the pressure I am putting on myself is that I entered into the WI state tournament which is next weekend.

When I was shooting in the early 80s, I was one match away from getting my expert card. If I recall correctly, once you shot at the next higher class in 3 matches (tournements) they bumped you to the next class.

I also see that they changed the classification indexes somewhere in the past 25 years or so. There is now a high-master class which I don't recall back then.

Thanks guys.

Chris

waxman · Post by **waxman** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 8:18 am

Chris_D, The NRA issues you a clasification card after 360 shots in a particular disipline like Indoor, Outdoor, etc. Thats four (4) 900 matches.
If you improve after another 360 shots, they'll up your classification.

I see you have a 2X dot on your Model 41. How do you like it? I've been thinking about going that route. Any downsides besides making wobble appear larger?

Levergun59 · Post by **Levergun59** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 10:14 am

I don't think your problem is anticipation of recoil. It might be your grip pressure. Lessening the grip pressure would throw the shots high and right. This would be due to muscle fatigue as you have started up. It should go away after a few more weeks of training. Just a thought
Chris

Chris_D · Post by **Chris_D** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:18 am

waxman wrote:Chris_D, The NRA issues you a clasification card after 360 shots in a particular disipline like Indoor, Outdoor, etc. Thats four (4) 900 matches.
If you improve after another 360 shots, they'll up your classification.

I see you have a 2X dot on your Model 41. How do you like it? I've been thinking about going that route. Any downsides besides making wobble appear larger?

Thanks for the info on classification.

Regarding the Burris scope, I liked it a lot 25 years ago. My eyes have never been "good", I always wore prescription glasses. But now it seems that there are many more problems with the eyes. My depth of field is really bad so iron sights are very hard to shoot with. My low-light vision has also taken a beating so a black reticle on a black target is tough to make sense of.

I am currently borrowing a 45 that has a red dot sight. It makes it VERY easy to determine when the sight is on target and being only 1X, my shakes don't seem so bad.

At the moment, I am giving very serious thought to going to ultradot sights on all my guns. But, I will hold off on that till I settle down my shooting problems.

Chris

Chris_D · Post by **Chris_D** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:25 am

Levergun59 wrote:I don't think your problem is anticipation of recoil. It might be your grip pressure. Lessening the grip pressure would throw the shots high and right. This would be due to muscle fatigue as you have started up. It should go away after a few more weeks of training. Just a thought
Chris

Chris,

You are correct, it is grip pressure. I noticed this during my last practice session. My Model 41 has harret grips which I have set pretty tight whereas my other 2 guns have normal grips. What I think I have been doing is squeezing the grips hard enough to make my hand feel like it is in the harret grips. Once I realized that I started to relax the grip and saw that my shaking was reduced a lot. My practice sessions was all timed fire and my scores went up markedly. I am now shooting a solid 88% with my model 52, 93% with my model 41. I had a scope zero problem with the 45 so I couldn't score it, but my groups were much better.

I certainly forgot much of the fundementals in the last 25 years, but luckily I am able to think through the problems to figure out what is going on. Fixing the problems, well, we shall see and only time will tell at this point.

Chris

ghillieman · Post by **ghillieman** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:35 pm

Welcome back Chris,

My .02, buy a couple thousand .22lr and shoot that 41 until everything comes back.

Oh, btw, dont forget BRASS
Breathe, Relax, Aim, Slowly Squeeze.

ghillieman · Post by **ghillieman** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:41 pm

Check out rimfirecentral.com, there is a section to post your .22 bullseye scores. There is a "match" every month, all month long.

bob v · Post by **bob v** » Thu Apr 07, 2011 2:23 pm

At the moment, I am giving very serious thought to going to ultradot sights on all my guns. But, I will hold off on that till I settle down my shooting problems.

Cris,
I too returned to BE shooting after about 25 yrs. and found everyone shooting Red Dots instead of scopes. I went from iron sites to red dot and immediately put 10 points on my score. As mentioned before ,give yourself some time and yoiur skills will sharpen up again. Good luck.....bob v

Chris_D · Post by **Chris_D** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:41 am

My first tournament in about 25 years - it was fun and funny!

This tournament was the WI state in Beloit - great facility and great people there. I went to the tournament with the mind set of getting back into the swing of things with no expectations what-so-ever which kept my intensity level low - I wanted to have fun.

Started out with 22 and the first string called was for 10 rounds-10 minutes. I loaded 5 rounds, and assumed 5 minutes. I got done with the string ahead of everyone, wondered why that 5 minutes seemed so long, then we returned the targets. Everyone else had 10 holes, I only had 5 holes. I could have cursed myself, but instead laughed it off with everyone and proceeded to move forward with a light mood.

The other shooters were all really good shots and of course really nice people. I had the left lane so I didn't score anyone (which was good because I obviously needed all the time in the world to prepare for the next string). The guy scoring me, Dan, was a really good shot and he also really studied my targets to see if there were any on the edge shots that he could bump to the next ring. He really took it serious and was a real gentleman. He was also a much better shot than I which helped me to want to compete again.

Throughout the match I had some moments of greatness mixed in with a lot of bad shooting and dumb mistakes. The dumb mistakes were mostly the usual things: lost focus, trying to hurry, not shooting the full string. I also messed up an alibie when my model 52 didn't fire and by reaction I ejected the round and tried again - I should have just raised a hand and left the gun alone.

What was discovered of myself was that I am still a good shooter, just not consistant yet. The day before the match I practiced only timed and rapid fire with the model 41 & 52. I needed to get my timing back and get over that "flinching" problem mentioned earlier in this thread. The practice certainly helped with my timing - very much so. It also helped with my flinching. I shot several high 90s targets in either timed or rapid fire. I believe my highest was a 97 3X with the 45. By that point in the match I got my rythm back and was back to pulling the trigger without hesitations.

The end result of the whole match was that I learned a lot about my problems. I was able to get better at shooting with the advice of folks here in the forum. I had a really good time competing again and I am potentially a good shooter and it looks like I am hooked again on bullseye shooting.

Chris

penman53 · Post by **penman53** » Fri May 27, 2011 7:01 pm

You need to start dry firing a lot, also if you are a right handed shooter, you may be inconsistant as to where you are placing your finger on the trigger. That is what my mentor would want me to do if I was shooting like that.

Welcome back, Mark

tuj · Post by **tuj** » Wed Jun 01, 2011 1:47 pm

One trick for over-coming flinching is to have a buddy load a dummy round or empty into your magazine without you looking. This way you have no idea if its the first round or the fifth. Then have him watch you as you shoot the string. If you flinch on the dummy round, it should be pretty obvious.

Another idea is to just pretend like you are shooting a .22. I know, hard to do, but if you can, it takes away a lot from recoil anticipation.