.22 testing...interesting

A place to discuss non-discipline specific items, such as mental training, ammo needs, and issues regarding ISSF, USAS, and NRA

If you wish to make a donation to this forum's operation , it would be greatly appreciated.
https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/targettalk?yours=true

Moderators: pilkguns, m1963, David Levene, Spencer, Richard H

Rover
Posts: 7049
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Location: Idaho panhandle

.22 testing...interesting

Post by Rover »

I found this on another forum. You'll find it interesting or appalling.

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve ... 9871088921

Do YOU do your own tests?
Last edited by Rover on Sun Apr 25, 2010 9:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
GOVTMODEL
Posts: 649
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 11:14 am
Location: Rhode Island, USA

Testing 22LR ammo

Post by GOVTMODEL »

Havng been to the Eley Customer Range, I absolutely believe the results of testing ammunition yields results that are only valid for that particular barrel/ammo lot combination, and no other.

That's why Eley and Lapua have customer ranges:-)
User avatar
RobStubbs
Posts: 3183
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 1:06 pm
Location: Herts, England, UK

Re: Testing 22LR ammo

Post by RobStubbs »

GOVTMODEL wrote:Havng been to the Eley Customer Range, I absolutely believe the results of testing ammunition yields results that are only valid for that particular barrel/ammo lot combination, and no other.

That's why Eley and Lapua have customer ranges:-)
Totally agree.

Rob.
User avatar
Richard H
Posts: 2654
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 11:55 am
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Contact:

Post by Richard H »

All those test really show are if that barrel / ammo are a match, don't really see the relevance in it. You definitely can't draw conclusions about ammo brand from it which I think some on that forum think they can.
Rover
Posts: 7049
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Location: Idaho panhandle

Post by Rover »

Those who follow my posts know that I espouse doing your own testing.

I say, start with the cheap stuff and work up until you get a satisfactory level of performance.

Some say, just buy the"best" and it'll work.

I KNOW we have some opinions on this out there.
jipe
Posts: 812
Joined: Wed May 02, 2007 5:50 am

Post by jipe »

Remember the ammo test done by Visier with most .22lr match pistols: no ammo provided the smallest grouping in all pistols, each pistols had its "prefered" ammo that provides the smallest grouping.
User avatar
Rutty
Posts: 263
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 2:25 am
Location: Rutland, United Kingdom

Post by Rutty »

Some say, just buy the"best" and it'll work.
Not necessarily and in any case it's not worth buying the "best" unless you are going to batch test it beforehand. If you intend to buy a random batch of ammunition without testing it would probably be just as worthwhile buying the grade below the "best". It would be cheaper and just as likely to perform as well as the untested "best" batch.

if you are going to test grades as well as batches, the manufacturers would have us believe that the "best" is manufactured to more stringent tolerances and therefore likely to be more consistent. If you use a much cheaper grade of ammunition then you pays your money and takes your chance. I have seen very good groups from cheap ammunition but I've seen the same batches produce fliers as well.

Rutty
Telecomtodd
Posts: 221
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:15 pm
Location: Saint Charles, MO

Post by Telecomtodd »

I've found that careful weight testing of every single round you're going to shoot for record score will result in execellent recurring groupings. This would allow you to use cheaper ammo, but utilizing your own quality assurance. I would group ammo in 0.5 grain tolerances. The cheaper the ammo, the wider the sample quantities. I randomly tested a box of 50 SK Match and found that 36 of the rounds matched a certain weight. When shot, the groups were tight. I'll test some Eley Tenex and see what those numbers look like. I recently shot a match using Tenex where I had 2 or 3 unexplainable fliers, so in my opinion everything needs to get tested. Then I would/should have been only 11 shots down, but still just under master, grr.
GTFS
Posts: 43
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:12 am
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post by GTFS »

Hi Telecomtodd
What scales do you use for the testing? I have had a look around and there are lots to choose from. Is +/-0.2 grains an accurate enough scale?


I am thinking 10 what are you thinking?

Glen Turner
Telecomtodd +1

Post by Telecomtodd +1 »

I use a Dillon beam scale that is made under license from Ohaus. You need resolution to .1 grains.
GTFS
Posts: 43
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:12 am
Location: Melbourne Australia

Post by GTFS »

Ok thanks mate. I will test some ammo and see if it works.

Glen Turner
M3taal
Posts: 11
Joined: Thu Jan 28, 2010 8:04 am
Location: The Netherlands

Post by M3taal »

Telecomtodd wrote:I've found that careful weight testing of every single round you're going to shoot for record score will result in execellent recurring groupings. This would allow you to use cheaper ammo, but utilizing your own quality assurance. I would group ammo in 0.5 grain tolerances. The cheaper the ammo, the wider the sample quantities. I randomly tested a box of 50 SK Match and found that 36 of the rounds matched a certain weight. When shot, the groups were tight. I'll test some Eley Tenex and see what those numbers look like. I recently shot a match using Tenex where I had 2 or 3 unexplainable fliers, so in my opinion everything needs to get tested. Then I would/should have been only 11 shots down, but still just under master, grr.
Ive heard a lot of complaints about the Tenex lately, about other Eley cartridges aswell btw. In my club they stopped selling Eley a few months ago, because we rated them too instable.
User avatar
GOVTMODEL
Posts: 649
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 11:14 am
Location: Rhode Island, USA

Post by GOVTMODEL »

Rutty wrote:
Some say, just buy the"best" and it'll work.
Not necessarily and in any case it's not worth buying the "best" unless you are going to batch test it beforehand.

if you are going to test grades as well as batches, the manufacturers would have us believe that the "best" is manufactured to more stringent tolerances and therefore likely to be more consistent.

Rutty
In fact, at least at the Eley works, the ammunition is manufactured, then QA tested to see what label goes on the box. TENEX, Match, and Match pistol are all grades of the same product.
TB
Posts: 236
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 5:50 am
Location: Denmark

Post by TB »

GOVTMODEL wrote:In fact, at least at the Eley works, the ammunition is manufactured, then QA tested to see what label goes on the box. TENEX, Match, and Match pistol are all grades of the same product.
I think you mean Tenex, Match and Team are all grades of the same product?!

Match Pistol is a softer round than the others and can therefore not be a grade of the same product as Tenex etc.!
User avatar
GOVTMODEL
Posts: 649
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 11:14 am
Location: Rhode Island, USA

Post by GOVTMODEL »

TB wrote:
GOVTMODEL wrote:In fact, at least at the Eley works, the ammunition is manufactured, then QA tested to see what label goes on the box. TENEX, Match, and Match pistol are all grades of the same product.
I think you mean Tenex, Match and Team are all grades of the same product?!

Match Pistol is a softer round than the others and can therefore not be a grade of the same product as Tenex etc.!
You're probably correct. Is it a white or a black bullet?
TB
Posts: 236
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 5:50 am
Location: Denmark

Post by TB »

GOVTMODEL wrote:
TB wrote:
GOVTMODEL wrote:In fact, at least at the Eley works, the ammunition is manufactured, then QA tested to see what label goes on the box. TENEX, Match, and Match pistol are all grades of the same product.
I think you mean Tenex, Match and Team are all grades of the same product?!

Match Pistol is a softer round than the others and can therefore not be a grade of the same product as Tenex etc.!
You're probably correct. Is it a white or a black bullet?
I don't understand the question, but you can see the properties of the Eley line here on page 4 http://www.eley.co.uk/media/386468/2010 ... 0guide.pdf
User avatar
GOVTMODEL
Posts: 649
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 11:14 am
Location: Rhode Island, USA

Post by GOVTMODEL »

The bullets on the TENEX line are white. The bullets on the other line are black. At least in 2002 when I went to visit.
dhurt

Post by dhurt »

Howdy Rover, What is your method for testing ammo in your free pistols? I have a hard time bench testing, so I go for my gut impression according to my call. Pretty unscientific!! Thanks, Dwaine
Rover
Posts: 7049
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:20 pm
Location: Idaho panhandle

Post by Rover »

I take the grip off and clamp the pistol half-assed into a Ransom Rest. I test at 50 yards with 10 shot groups for starters. I shoot more rounds into the group if the ammo looks promising.
dhurt

Post by dhurt »

And for your Morini? Thanks, Dwaine
Post Reply