I fire too soon

[rlabbe]

I'm just starting out in pistol, though I had the typical rural upbringing of always having a rifle at hand (I say that to point out I may have acquired many bad habits), and then had some rifle training with ROTC about 20 years ago.

I find that I'm frequently depressing the trigger even though I know the sights are not aimed properly at the target. I haven't noticed this happening when the sight alignment isn't correct (I think I'm using the terminology right - front sight and back sight aligned).

Even as I'm tightening my finger my brain is going NOOO!

I think my aiming and follow through are relatively solid - my front sight is in focus both during and after the shot, and I can call where the pellet went without looking at the target.

So, how do I fix this? Is it just more range time & dry firing, or is there something more specific to practice?

I'm not practicing for any specific discipline at this point, I'm just trying to get accurate.

[joker]

I'm just starting out in pistol, though I had the typical rural upbringing of always having a rifle at hand (I say that to point out I may have acquired many bad habits), and then had some rifle training with ROTC about 20 years ago.

I find that I'm frequently depressing the trigger even though I know the sights are not aimed properly at the target. I haven't noticed this happening when the sight alignment isn't correct (I think I'm using the terminology right - front sight and back sight aligned).

Even as I'm tightening my finger my brain is going NOOO!

I think my aiming and follow through are relatively solid - my front sight is in focus both during and after the shot, and I can call where the pellet went without looking at the target.

So, how do I fix this? Is it just more range time & dry firing, or is there something more specific to practice?

I'm not practicing for any specific discipline at this point, I'm just trying to get accurate.

Does this mean that you are actually releasing a shot at this point?

[rlabbe]

Does this mean that you are actually releasing a shot at this point?

Sorry for the wording. Yes, I'm firing despite knowing the sight picture is bad.

[Pat McCoy]

You have to learn to listen to that voice, and reject the shot.

One idea is to have a positive thought in your mind as the past step of your pre-shot routine, always the same thought, and when that is not there you must reject that shot.

In rifle I suggest a picture of either the prefect sight picture, or a picture of the projectile going through the ten ring. when that picture is no longer there, that shot is over, and a new shot must be started by lowering the gun, and re-running your pre-shot routine.

[FredB]

I'm just starting out in pistol...

I find that I'm frequently depressing the trigger even though I know the sights are not aimed properly at the target. I haven't noticed this happening when the sight alignment isn't correct (I think I'm using the terminology right - front sight and back sight aligned).

Even as I'm tightening my finger my brain is going NOOO!

I think my aiming and follow through are relatively solid - my front sight is in focus both during and after the shot, and I can call where the pellet went without looking at the target.

So, how do I fix this? Is it just more range time & dry firing, or is there something more specific to practice?

I'm not practicing for any specific discipline at this point, I'm just trying to get accurate.

If I understand your post correctly, you are releasing your shot when the alignment is perfected, and you are not looking at the target - but rather the front sight - at the time the shot is released.

This IS the correct way to shoot target pistol. Your brain is "going NOOO" because your (conscious) brain wants to control every step of the process, and make sure that your shot is "perfectly" accurate. You can't shoot pistol that way.

IMHO you have developed an excellent habit that will make you into a good pistol shooter, once you have shot enough for your subconscious to learn how to get the sights on target during your release process. If I were you, I wouldn't change anything.

HTH,
FredB

[2650 Plus]

Fred B. Agree, Agree Agree. This shooter is well on his way to top competition scores.He must not change a thing as what he is doing is totatly correct. Let him develope a steady hold { which will come with time ] and he is well on his way to a national championship'. I wish I had begun with such a clear path to top scores. Good Shooting Bill Horton

[rlabbe]

If I understand your post correctly, you are releasing your shot when the alignment is perfected, and you are not looking at the target - but rather the front sight - at the time the shot is released.

This IS the correct way to shoot target pistol. Your brain is "going NOOO" because your (conscious) brain wants to control every step of the process, and make sure that your shot is "perfectly" accurate. You can't shoot pistol that way

No, the front sight is correctly aligned with the back sight, but the point of aim is not correct - either it's not pointing at the 6 o'clock position or the pistol is in the process of moving away from the target. A shot should not be released at that point of time. I know it, I see it, and I fire anyway.

With my good shots trigger control seems pretty unconsious. Not entirely, and not always, but it feels like when everything is perfect the gun just fires and there's no point in looking to see if I hit what I was aiming at because I know I did. My substandard shots seem to usually be I pulled the trigger because I get impatient and just try to take the best that I can get (haven't figured out what is going on here - I think my stance is not putting the natural point of aim on the target, so I'm fighting the pistol) .

And then you have the shots that the OP is about - the pistol is not aimed correctly, I know it, I don't want to shoot, I shouldn't shoot, but I still fire.

[FredB]

No, the front sight is correctly aligned with the back sight, but the point of aim is not correct - either it's not pointing at the 6 o'clock position or the pistol is in the process of moving away from the target. A shot should not be released at that point of time. I know it, I see it, and I fire anyway.

With my good shots trigger control seems pretty unconsious. Not entirely, and not always, but it feels like when everything is perfect the gun just fires and there's no point in looking to see if I hit what I was aiming at because I know I did. My substandard shots seem to usually be I pulled the trigger because I get impatient and just try to take the best that I can get (haven't figured out what is going on here - I think my stance is not putting the natural point of aim on the target, so I'm fighting the pistol) .

And then you have the shots that the OP is about - the pistol is not aimed correctly, I know it, I don't want to shoot, I shouldn't shoot, but I still fire.

Sorry I apparently misunderstood your posting. However, I still think the issue may be related to your thinking about "point of aim." That may be an accepted rifle concept (I'm not a rifle shooter), but it doesn't work for pistol. For pistol, the preferred concept is area of aim, and after a while you really don't think about "aim" at all. Sight alignment is far more important.

Brian Zins has a great way of explaining the timing. Say the center of the target is the North Pole and that's where you want your gun to be pointing when the shot leaves the barrel. You can't hold a pistol absolutely still, and there is a definite time lag between when you initiate trigger movement and when the shot leaves the barrel. Wherever your pistol is pointed when you start the trigger, it will be pointing somewhere else when the shot leaves the barrel. When you're standing on the North Pole, any step in any direction takes you off it. Therefore, you have to initiate trigger movement well before you are pointing at where you want the shot to go. If your shots occur when you are "moving away" from the target, they are too late, not too early.

HTH,
FredB

[2650 Plus]

Notice how close your description of your shot sequence dove tails into Brian Zins description of a shot delivery. You might start alligning the sights earlier and just let your trigger finger keep on doing its thing. Good Shooting Bill Horton[One after thought, If the movement appears to be in a straight line away from the center of your hold area you would be dealing with anticipation and a break in concentration from sight allignment to something like the shot is going off NOW!!!]

[rlabbe]

Okay, those posts help me tremendously. Thanks.

I have a question about point of aim. I hope this isn't considered thread drift.


This is a target I shot this morning. When shooting at the bullseye, my shots seem really to like the 7 and 8 ring. This is frustrating to me, as I considered myself a good shot in the day.

However, shooting the 6 o-clock position is all new to me. So I flipped a target over, drew a cross style target on the back side, and punched a single hole minus one flier. I've attached a photo, and drew a circle indicating the black part of the front of the target so you can evaluate my grouping when shooting with a 6 o'clock position vs shooting at a very accurately defined target. To clarify, when I aimed at the cross I put the sights on the cross intersection, which is why the groupings for the cross are considerably higher than the cross. (Obviously the cross shots are higher than half a bullseye height - I don't know if that was consistent shooter error or sight misadjustment, but that seems less important to me at this point).

I have no idea if I'm on or off when doing 6'oclock aiming. Is improvement in this something that will 'just happen' with time, or is there something specific to do to fix this rather large error?