The MEC Sling
Over the past year, I spent a great deal of time using the noptel to optimize my shot process, but in order to bring my trace into an acceptable measure of steadiness, I looked very hard at three things. Relaxing in position with an extreme focus on keeping my NPA correct, having the right arm/shoulder assembly completely relaxed, AND optimizing the sling position/placement.
My Anschutz sling felt pretty good, but I had heard about the new MEC Sling and had looked it up. It looked, like all the MEC products I had ordered and loved, to be extremely “smart”. The arm band can be tightened around the bicep to whatever tension you like. Similar to some of the “pulse-less” slings of the past, there is a second loop that comes off the arm band to support what I call the “Machine”. This second loop has the ability to swivel up and down. This relieves pressure on the arm band keeping its own pressure around the bicep consistent and strongly in place. The Machine can be set at an angle to keep from interfering with your forearm and has a micro-adjustment dial that is easy to turn and lock while in position. There is a single strand of material that buckles into the machine that attaches to the handstop. Once you have the dimensions (general length, arm band diameter) figured out, the adjustments you can make from that point on are virtually limitless.
The Restrictor Unit
There is a piece of metal with a thin groove through it that is to be positioned on the secondary loop. This piece is held in place by two bold/screws and can be positioned anywhere on that loop - as a stopping point for the Machine (as it will try to move to the inside of your arm.) I have a preference of keeping my sling pulling from the outside of my arm and this small addition to the system made all the difference. Once I had it placed correctly, the tension on the inside of the arm reduced considerably and I began to see the Noptel trace get smaller and smaller.
I whole heartedly recommend the MEC Sling to everyone. It’s expensive - $240 – but for good reason. You will understand why if you get to see/use one. It is a very fine piece of equipment. All its components are of the highest quality. So if you feel like there is a stone left yet unturned and you shoot to WIN – you might take a hard look at this item. It can be ordered from Joacim and Liz at Try& Bom. The sling comes with a handstop attachment that works with the “push-in-2-release” handstops.
BParnall
MEC Sling Review
Moderators: pilkguns, Marcus, m1963, David Levene, Spencer
MEC Sling Review
Hi Bart
I like reading you posts they are always full of good info, I agree with you I have one of these slings and I love it, It's the best sling I have ever had and I dont think I have maximised it's full potential yet. because I take the rifle out of the shoulder after each shot I love the way it self centers on the arm band, much more consistant than the old sling.
Highly recommended
I am thinking 10 what are you thinking?
Glen Turner
I like reading you posts they are always full of good info, I agree with you I have one of these slings and I love it, It's the best sling I have ever had and I dont think I have maximised it's full potential yet. because I take the rifle out of the shoulder after each shot I love the way it self centers on the arm band, much more consistant than the old sling.
Highly recommended
I am thinking 10 what are you thinking?
Glen Turner
Hi Bart
Thank you for the interest
That’s a good question and a lot of other people have asked me this before
No I don’t have a physical limitation that I am trying to work around.
When I started shooting in the late 1980,s it was a lot more common to take the rifle out of the shoulder to load than it is today. My coach back then said load whichever way works for you. I have tried to load from the shoulder a number of times before but I find it really hard and not as consistent as remounting for me.
My Noptel agrees with me.
I can also see the advantage some people can get with loading from the shoulder such as speed. I normally take about 50 min to shoot a 60 shot match but can do it in 40 min if the need be.
If you want to take a break during a match or final most people I know would take the rifle out and remount after, some people I shoot with do 10 shot strings and then remount for the next 10 shots. Some even get up during a match and resettle into position (not me). I think remounting is a skill anybody who wants to be any good at this game needs to learn, just like we all need to know how to shade the aim and adjust the sights for changing wind or getting the shots down range fast if the conditions are right. The more skills we have the better, we might just need them to WIN one day.
What do you think?
Anyway back to the topic.
The way the MEC sling self centres on the arm loop works great for me because I remount each time, if you shoot this way as well it’s a good feature. I highly recommend this sling.
I am thinking 10 what are you thinking?
Glen Turner
Thank you for the interest
That’s a good question and a lot of other people have asked me this before
No I don’t have a physical limitation that I am trying to work around.
When I started shooting in the late 1980,s it was a lot more common to take the rifle out of the shoulder to load than it is today. My coach back then said load whichever way works for you. I have tried to load from the shoulder a number of times before but I find it really hard and not as consistent as remounting for me.
My Noptel agrees with me.
I can also see the advantage some people can get with loading from the shoulder such as speed. I normally take about 50 min to shoot a 60 shot match but can do it in 40 min if the need be.
If you want to take a break during a match or final most people I know would take the rifle out and remount after, some people I shoot with do 10 shot strings and then remount for the next 10 shots. Some even get up during a match and resettle into position (not me). I think remounting is a skill anybody who wants to be any good at this game needs to learn, just like we all need to know how to shade the aim and adjust the sights for changing wind or getting the shots down range fast if the conditions are right. The more skills we have the better, we might just need them to WIN one day.
What do you think?
Anyway back to the topic.
The way the MEC sling self centres on the arm loop works great for me because I remount each time, if you shoot this way as well it’s a good feature. I highly recommend this sling.
I am thinking 10 what are you thinking?
Glen Turner
Hey Glenn,
I have to agree that being able to remove the rifle from your shoulder and be able to put it right back in the same place each time is a valuable skill. Personally, I practice this skill quite extensively, but it's not for every shot. It's for being able to Rest during the match and for Breaks during Finals.
I tend to practice in varying wind/mirage conditions on purpose so being able to wait out the condition, put the gun back to the right spot, and keep on drilling 10s is a must. BUT...being able to rip off 5-8 shots is less than a minute when the conditions are perfect is a skill needed to keep my scores averaging between 595 and 597. As much as BEING ABLE to take the rifle OUT is a benefit, absolutely HAVING to remove would be an unfortunate drawback for me.
I have tried every method of loading. When I was very young, I needed to take it from my shoulder, but as my arms grew, I was able to to reach up and over to drop the bullet in. Today, I simply lean the rifle slight to the right and down. My right elbow rarely leaves the mat. This is a relatively new process in total, but I have found the speed it afford highly beneficial to achieving very high scores and for match-long comfort. Photos of my position and videos of my shooting style are very similar to Warren Potent - although I can say that she shoots faster than anyone I've ever seen. From his last breath to pulling the trigger, he "might" have 2 to 3 seconds. My process takes at least 6-8 seconds.
Good luck with your shooting, Glenn. Sounds like you know what workd for you! :) Bart
I have to agree that being able to remove the rifle from your shoulder and be able to put it right back in the same place each time is a valuable skill. Personally, I practice this skill quite extensively, but it's not for every shot. It's for being able to Rest during the match and for Breaks during Finals.
I tend to practice in varying wind/mirage conditions on purpose so being able to wait out the condition, put the gun back to the right spot, and keep on drilling 10s is a must. BUT...being able to rip off 5-8 shots is less than a minute when the conditions are perfect is a skill needed to keep my scores averaging between 595 and 597. As much as BEING ABLE to take the rifle OUT is a benefit, absolutely HAVING to remove would be an unfortunate drawback for me.
I have tried every method of loading. When I was very young, I needed to take it from my shoulder, but as my arms grew, I was able to to reach up and over to drop the bullet in. Today, I simply lean the rifle slight to the right and down. My right elbow rarely leaves the mat. This is a relatively new process in total, but I have found the speed it afford highly beneficial to achieving very high scores and for match-long comfort. Photos of my position and videos of my shooting style are very similar to Warren Potent - although I can say that she shoots faster than anyone I've ever seen. From his last breath to pulling the trigger, he "might" have 2 to 3 seconds. My process takes at least 6-8 seconds.
Good luck with your shooting, Glenn. Sounds like you know what workd for you! :) Bart
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Guest_66
Hi 66,
If I am looking down on the secondary loop that the Machine is attached to... I put the Restrictor piece about 1 inch left of center. It's not a huge offset, but it seems to do the trick. Now, with that said, that placement is based on the my configuration CUSTOM to ME. My advice is to use it just left of center and slowly move it out gradually to see what works for you.
Good luck. I think you'll find that your hold will significantly improve once you find that sweet spot. Bart
If I am looking down on the secondary loop that the Machine is attached to... I put the Restrictor piece about 1 inch left of center. It's not a huge offset, but it seems to do the trick. Now, with that said, that placement is based on the my configuration CUSTOM to ME. My advice is to use it just left of center and slowly move it out gradually to see what works for you.
Good luck. I think you'll find that your hold will significantly improve once you find that sweet spot. Bart
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Guest_66
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guidolastra
- Posts: 137
- Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 9:59 pm
- Location: Columbia, MO
MEC sling
OK, as someone with lots of pulse-sling problems in prone and specially in kneeling, I have been convinced to spend this huge money on a sling, and I just ordered one. I have seen so many good reviews not only in this but in other forums, that I feel compelled to give it a try...
I am not understanding one thing: if the effect of the sling on pulse is to minimize (or just blunt it according to some of you) because it makes the pull come from the back of the arm, then why should you use the restrictor part ?
I am not understanding one thing: if the effect of the sling on pulse is to minimize (or just blunt it according to some of you) because it makes the pull come from the back of the arm, then why should you use the restrictor part ?
The Restrictor keeps the Machine from rotating to the front of the arm thereby forcing the tension to come from the OUTSIDE of the arm - thus avoiding the brachial artery that is closest to the surface on the INSIDE of the arm.
Said another way, the combination of a proper right shoulder strap tightness, the back panel of the jacket fitting correctly, the sling keeper, and the Restrictor enable 90% of the sling's tension AWAY from the inner-upper arm.
Bart
Said another way, the combination of a proper right shoulder strap tightness, the back panel of the jacket fitting correctly, the sling keeper, and the Restrictor enable 90% of the sling's tension AWAY from the inner-upper arm.
Bart
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Guest_66
I have now tried the sling with the restrictor part. This piece made it easy to get the pull from the outside, something that I have never managed to get with my previous sling!
In my case, I first had to secure the "machine" as Bart names it, to the strap on my jacket. Otherwise the whole machine will slowly rotate to the front of the arm by the pull.
The major difference in my opinion is:
- Less pulse (but remember that pulse can come from everywhere, so don't expect your shooting to be "pulse free")
- EASY to get the pull from the outside
- I like the thing that the sling attaches directly to the hand stop. No swivel that causes pessure on the hand.
I think you will like it :)
In my case, I first had to secure the "machine" as Bart names it, to the strap on my jacket. Otherwise the whole machine will slowly rotate to the front of the arm by the pull.
The major difference in my opinion is:
- Less pulse (but remember that pulse can come from everywhere, so don't expect your shooting to be "pulse free")
- EASY to get the pull from the outside
- I like the thing that the sling attaches directly to the hand stop. No swivel that causes pessure on the hand.
I think you will like it :)
-
glg
sling review
I just got my MEC/CENTRA sling. As Bart pointed out, a very smart product indeed (may be too smart for me, as there are several adjustments). It is extremely comfortable. I tried it first without the RESTRICTOR part, and the pulse transmission was increased compared to my previous AKAH logic belt, as checked in the scatt. With the RESTRICTOR making the pull come from the outside oft the arm, the pulse was indeed reduced again, but (STILL THERE !) to a level comparable to my previous sling.
I have used it only once in live shooting and a couple more times on scatt. I will keep trying and let you all know.
So far my assessment is: a very comfortable piece of equipment, very nice looking and completely elminates a possible contact between sling and trigger guard (only one strap on the front loop). I cannot say so far it really eliminates the pulse, however.
I have used it only once in live shooting and a couple more times on scatt. I will keep trying and let you all know.
So far my assessment is: a very comfortable piece of equipment, very nice looking and completely elminates a possible contact between sling and trigger guard (only one strap on the front loop). I cannot say so far it really eliminates the pulse, however.
HELP!! :)
Hi guys/gals,
First thing. NOTHING IS GOING TO ELIMINATE PULSE COMPLETELY.
My hold started as an upside down T-shape that had a outside trace measurement of around 14mm. After a great deal of hard work, it is now under 7mm and consists of a small tick from 9:30 to 3:30 on either side of a metric X. If I shoot a 9, it is because I had either a poor sight picture or I doped the conditions incorrectly or I didn't pick the right ammo.
Keep in mind that the overall system responsible for keeping the sling pulling from the outside of the arm starts at the RIGHT shoulder. Your jacket must fit well so that when you tighten the right shoulder straps, you are establishing the spot from which all left side "pull" is anchored. When you attach the sling to your sling hook/keeper, you are essentially attaching it in such a way as to use that anchor and the jacket's back panel to support the pull of the sling as it begins to make it's way around your arm and up to your hand.
I found that there are several sources of pulse. Some you may not be able to pinpoint without a noptel to analyze your pulse after some small but important changes.
1) Major Pulse - from the Brachial Artery on the inside of the left Bicep. Let's discuss this at length:
Everybody's arm and the position of the artery within their arm is going to be different. The first thing to do is FIND the WORST pulse with your fingers and make a mark on your arm. You want avoid placing the sling on this level. Now find the sweet spot where the artery begins to return to the center of the arm to pass through the elbow joint. It may be lower or higher than you expected. Finding this location gives you a point of reference that you MUST use to reduce the most amount of pulse. Once the sling is hooked up and pulling from the outside of the arm and you have engineered the sling to ride on the sweet spot on the inner arm, you will be in good position for the next step.
2) Gun Position Over the TOP of your Sling Elbow - I see many younger or inexperienced shooters make this mistake. If the position of the rifle is such that the rifle (looking down on the shooter from overhead) is OVER the left elbow (or close to being over it), you need to expand your geometry laterally to the right (for a right handed shooter) and take the pressure off the sling arm by spreading out a bit. I have had MANY advanced shooters who like their gun coming over their left elbow. But when they come over and they see their noptel trace, they almost throw up...then they change this simple orientation and it revolutionizes their game. By spreading out the geometry, you immediately cut the acute pressure from the back and inside of the upper sling arm and allow the sling keeper and Restrictor to its' work correctly. THIS IS A HUGE DEAL AND SHOULD BE LOOKED AT IMMEDIATELY.
Secondary Pulse Sources:
1) The Arm Band - If the Arm Band (that can be tightened around the bicep) is too tight, it can transmit pulse. Also, make sure that your jacket is not bunched up on the inner arm (inside the arm band) and that if there is bunching that you somehow rotate the folds to the outside of the arm rather than the inside. If the jacket bunches on the inside and the Arm Band is too tight, it can "reach' into the pocket between your bicep and tricep and tap that pulse rather easily. You wany the least amount of pressure on the inner arm as possible.
2) Your Hand Stop - I now it sounds crazy but the connecting device for this sling to your handstop is different than anything you have used before and can directly affect your steadiness via a pulse beat. I have tried several handstops over the the last year and found that the smaller hand stop I used, the better. When I tried to switch to a larger (and sometimes more comfortable) hand stop, I picked up a moderate pulse beat in the noptel. I believe this is due to the type of pressure exerted on the back of the hand. Now...I also believe this to be a personal choice and function. You yourself must find the hand stop that works the best for you.
3) Body Pulse/Tension - The Body, with all it's processes and inner workings can directly affect the steadiness of your rifle. When you eat certain foods, the work you stomach is doing to digest it requires muscular churning. So before you decide to work out the kinks in your pulse please remember a few things: a) you are increasing the demand on the heart by eating a large or "difficult to digest" meal before shooting, b) the muscles in your stomach will be activated as you lay on your belly and can add to the overall movement of your rifle, and c) you should try to bring your right leg up at a slightly exaggerated angle to test the reduction of body pulse then slowly move it back down into what appears to be the most comfortable and functional position (this will take pressure off your bowel which comes into direct contact with the ground). Just ahead of big matches, I actually use a very light herbal laxative to ensure that food is not going to have any problems traversing the 'great beyond' while I am shooting. The more you clear the path for good digestion, the more you ensure smooth sailing in general.
ALSO - when you are doing sling-work, it is often a difficult physical process - which will raise your heart rate. Be sure that when you are making these changes that you break from position frequently, breathe and relax, and calm your mind and body before re-engaging the analysis. The mind, under a certain amount of frustration and pressure, can really throw off a solid path of progress. I use a heart rate monitor when I shoot. It lets me know when I have regained my (internal and mental) composure and also allows me to identify my pulse internally, so that I am able to shoot (even with iron sights) between heart beats.
When I hear that someone has not had improvement in their pulse problem area by using this sling, I immediately suspect that there are other fundamental issues playing their hand. The simple change of moving the "pull" to the outside of the arm ALWAYS shows an improvement. It can't be helped. But as you can see, there are many many elements to pulse reduction that must be analyzed and meticulously addressed to have the greatest amount of overall success.
Please send me your ideas. I am happy to discuss them further if you think it will help. Bart
First thing. NOTHING IS GOING TO ELIMINATE PULSE COMPLETELY.
My hold started as an upside down T-shape that had a outside trace measurement of around 14mm. After a great deal of hard work, it is now under 7mm and consists of a small tick from 9:30 to 3:30 on either side of a metric X. If I shoot a 9, it is because I had either a poor sight picture or I doped the conditions incorrectly or I didn't pick the right ammo.
Keep in mind that the overall system responsible for keeping the sling pulling from the outside of the arm starts at the RIGHT shoulder. Your jacket must fit well so that when you tighten the right shoulder straps, you are establishing the spot from which all left side "pull" is anchored. When you attach the sling to your sling hook/keeper, you are essentially attaching it in such a way as to use that anchor and the jacket's back panel to support the pull of the sling as it begins to make it's way around your arm and up to your hand.
I found that there are several sources of pulse. Some you may not be able to pinpoint without a noptel to analyze your pulse after some small but important changes.
1) Major Pulse - from the Brachial Artery on the inside of the left Bicep. Let's discuss this at length:
Everybody's arm and the position of the artery within their arm is going to be different. The first thing to do is FIND the WORST pulse with your fingers and make a mark on your arm. You want avoid placing the sling on this level. Now find the sweet spot where the artery begins to return to the center of the arm to pass through the elbow joint. It may be lower or higher than you expected. Finding this location gives you a point of reference that you MUST use to reduce the most amount of pulse. Once the sling is hooked up and pulling from the outside of the arm and you have engineered the sling to ride on the sweet spot on the inner arm, you will be in good position for the next step.
2) Gun Position Over the TOP of your Sling Elbow - I see many younger or inexperienced shooters make this mistake. If the position of the rifle is such that the rifle (looking down on the shooter from overhead) is OVER the left elbow (or close to being over it), you need to expand your geometry laterally to the right (for a right handed shooter) and take the pressure off the sling arm by spreading out a bit. I have had MANY advanced shooters who like their gun coming over their left elbow. But when they come over and they see their noptel trace, they almost throw up...then they change this simple orientation and it revolutionizes their game. By spreading out the geometry, you immediately cut the acute pressure from the back and inside of the upper sling arm and allow the sling keeper and Restrictor to its' work correctly. THIS IS A HUGE DEAL AND SHOULD BE LOOKED AT IMMEDIATELY.
Secondary Pulse Sources:
1) The Arm Band - If the Arm Band (that can be tightened around the bicep) is too tight, it can transmit pulse. Also, make sure that your jacket is not bunched up on the inner arm (inside the arm band) and that if there is bunching that you somehow rotate the folds to the outside of the arm rather than the inside. If the jacket bunches on the inside and the Arm Band is too tight, it can "reach' into the pocket between your bicep and tricep and tap that pulse rather easily. You wany the least amount of pressure on the inner arm as possible.
2) Your Hand Stop - I now it sounds crazy but the connecting device for this sling to your handstop is different than anything you have used before and can directly affect your steadiness via a pulse beat. I have tried several handstops over the the last year and found that the smaller hand stop I used, the better. When I tried to switch to a larger (and sometimes more comfortable) hand stop, I picked up a moderate pulse beat in the noptel. I believe this is due to the type of pressure exerted on the back of the hand. Now...I also believe this to be a personal choice and function. You yourself must find the hand stop that works the best for you.
3) Body Pulse/Tension - The Body, with all it's processes and inner workings can directly affect the steadiness of your rifle. When you eat certain foods, the work you stomach is doing to digest it requires muscular churning. So before you decide to work out the kinks in your pulse please remember a few things: a) you are increasing the demand on the heart by eating a large or "difficult to digest" meal before shooting, b) the muscles in your stomach will be activated as you lay on your belly and can add to the overall movement of your rifle, and c) you should try to bring your right leg up at a slightly exaggerated angle to test the reduction of body pulse then slowly move it back down into what appears to be the most comfortable and functional position (this will take pressure off your bowel which comes into direct contact with the ground). Just ahead of big matches, I actually use a very light herbal laxative to ensure that food is not going to have any problems traversing the 'great beyond' while I am shooting. The more you clear the path for good digestion, the more you ensure smooth sailing in general.
ALSO - when you are doing sling-work, it is often a difficult physical process - which will raise your heart rate. Be sure that when you are making these changes that you break from position frequently, breathe and relax, and calm your mind and body before re-engaging the analysis. The mind, under a certain amount of frustration and pressure, can really throw off a solid path of progress. I use a heart rate monitor when I shoot. It lets me know when I have regained my (internal and mental) composure and also allows me to identify my pulse internally, so that I am able to shoot (even with iron sights) between heart beats.
When I hear that someone has not had improvement in their pulse problem area by using this sling, I immediately suspect that there are other fundamental issues playing their hand. The simple change of moving the "pull" to the outside of the arm ALWAYS shows an improvement. It can't be helped. But as you can see, there are many many elements to pulse reduction that must be analyzed and meticulously addressed to have the greatest amount of overall success.
Please send me your ideas. I am happy to discuss them further if you think it will help. Bart
Last edited by BartP on Sat Apr 24, 2010 6:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
Pictures
I do not currently have good pictures of the sling in action. But I do have a sponsor photoshoot scheduled for next weekend. I will make sure the pic-taker gets some good shots of the sling and I'll pass them along. B
As is usual, BartP provides numerous good points and advice for us to contemplate. The issue of pulse transmission is something I have been studying carefully over the past several weeks with the arrival of my new electronic trainer. Through discussions with my cardiologist friends where I work and some literature research, I have learned that arterial blood flow is around 3 feet per second. Therefore, the impulse felt in the chest is obviously correlated, but not simultaneous, with the impulse measured in other parts of the body. As BartP notes, there are several key body areas where an impulse can occur. The movement observed at the end of the barrel will be a summary effect of these sources and not temporally discrete with smaller wave form patterns during the control interval (usually 1 second which is close to the average heart rate). Changes in position, clothing adjustments, etc may reduce one source variable but not others and could, potentially, actually increase the input from other points. Lots of details to consider if you are so inclined.
Thanks Bart
By the way, what part of the MEC sling is the "restrictor"?
Dennis
Thanks Bart
By the way, what part of the MEC sling is the "restrictor"?
Dennis
I tend to provoke a pulse from sling tension around my forearm and not the bicep. I recently moved my position forward on the rifle and after a couple sessions it's eased off considerably (as in 90%). I use an Anschutz Swing sling rather than the MEC / Centra sling and quite like it.
Moving forward on the rifle allowed the sling to sit higher on my forearm / glove rather than the meaty part of my forearm. It sounds kind of obvious as I'm writing this but my old position worked well for me. Another plus is that my head rests more comfortably and consistently on the cheekpiece.
Is this all part of the lovely and ongoing learning process with prone?
Jason
Moving forward on the rifle allowed the sling to sit higher on my forearm / glove rather than the meaty part of my forearm. It sounds kind of obvious as I'm writing this but my old position worked well for me. Another plus is that my head rests more comfortably and consistently on the cheekpiece.
Is this all part of the lovely and ongoing learning process with prone?
Jason