Which AIR PISTOL????

[Dogchaser]

Now that we know he's a very strong shooter, what did he shoot in the 580s with?

I think most here would do a back flip after a score like that.

[Richard H]

A club pistol, don't know what model but is for the most part its irrelevant.

[Dogchaser]

A club pistol, don't know what model but is for the most part its irrelevant.

I figured someone with scores like that would have a substantial amount of trigger time and exposure to different A/Ps and develop some strong likes and dislikes.

My own opinion after having owned and operated an IZH-46M and an LP2...... get an LP10, I think I'm going to.

[jipe]

Let me be more cruel....

Buy a IZH46m....then it won't hurt so bad when you discover you can't buy even a few points of performance and probably not much in the way of dependability.

Little bit fed up with those statement about Izzy being the best AP. If we would believe them, nobody would use any other pistol but the Izzy.

Once for all, the Izzy is nothing else than a good, cheap AP for budgetless beginners.

*sigh* The Izzy is the most cost effective way for a new shooter to do several things;

• Find out if they like the sport and if it's a long-term endeavor.
  Determine if they have any natural ability
  - Allow them to train to a high-level of performance before having to buy something very expensive.
  Give's them a chance to shoot competitively in matches, where they will meet other shooters and get to hold and test others world-class pistols and see which pistol might be a good step-up down the road.

Why go hatin' on something that allows new shooters to be introduced to our sport with serious-quality and yet inexpensive? Can you imagine how quickly our sport would die if anyone new had to invest at least $1000 for the pistol to find out if they are interested or not?

Reading your post, I wonder if you have any recent experience with young/new shooters ?

Personnaly, having seen many new, young shooters, I do not agree with these statements:
- Find out if they like the sport and if it's a long-term endeavor: my experience is that the best way to have young shooter not liking shooting and stop with shooting is to make them start with a lever operated AP like the Izzy or FWB65. It has nothing to do with the performance of the pistol but with the pleasure it gives. Most shooters like the shooting feeling given by CO2 or PCP but dislike the one of spring/lever operated pistols.
- Determine if they have any natural ability: nobody is a born shooter especially for AP that requires a lot of learning/training. People make effort for things they like to do, that give them pleasure what is usually not the case with pistols like the Izzy.
- Allow them to train to a high-level of performance before having to buy something very expensive: for training, see above. About having a pistol to train without spending money, I do not know how its organized in the US but in Europe, all shooting clubs doing ISSF shooting own AP pistols that shooters can borrow for free of for a small fee. So they do not need to buy anything. Depending of the law of the different countries, it is the same for .22 match pistols in the countries where clubs can own fire arms.
- Give's them a chance to shoot competitively in matches, where they will meet other shooters and get to hold and test others world-class pistols and see which pistol might be a good step-up down the road: same as above: they can use the club pistol to shoot in matches.

Now about the budget for the clubs to buy top AP: some clubs have enough budget for PCP pistols (like LP2, or 162MI or even top level ones) some other uses CO2 pistols like FWB C10, C20 or C25 that can be bought used for about 300Euros and are very competitive and pleasant pistols (LP1 would also be a very good one but used prices are much higher !).

Last experience: my club own several AP, FWB65 and 80, C25 and LP2. No new/young shooter uses the FWB65 and 80 unless all other pistols are already in use. The only guys shooting with lever operated AP are in fact old people who started AP with these kind of pistols and used to shoot with them.

[Richard H]

A club pistol, don't know what model but is for the most part its irrelevant.

I figured someone with scores like that would have a substantial amount of trigger time and exposure to different A/Ps and develop some strong likes and dislikes.

My own opinion after having owned and operated an IZH-46M and an LP2...... get an LP10, I think I'm going to.

Actually he was posing this question for a friend.

Lots of top shooters spend time on shooting rather than the myriad of topics that are discussed on here. There is no magic pistol, no magic pellets, no magic trigger weight. Believe it or not they really don't care what a bunch of strangers on the internet think of any particular pistol.

All this "what is the best pistol, best pellet" is really just silly.

[Oz]

Reading your post, I wonder if you have any recent experience with young/new shooters ?

ARGH! I _AM_ the new shooter! I shot a little with an Izzy several years back, but got serious 7 months ago. The Izzy still easily out-shoots me.

To refute your thoughts; If someone doesn't continue shooting because they have to pump it, they aren't going to be long-term serious shooters. Quality long-term shooters are driven by competition and the desire to better themselves. THAT'S what's 'fun' for them. It's not the latest gadgets and coolest equipment. The fun you describe will drive a new shooter for 6 months. After that type of fun is over, you need the other type of REAL fun to drive you. Perfect example; How long do kids have 'fun' with new Christmas presents? Honestly, that's THAT'S the fun you just described.

Here's my personal experience in reality. My goal was to upgrade when I hit a 550. Others told me to upgrade at 525. The best advice I could have received regardless of the score. If I upgraded 2 months into my shooting I'd be shooting a 2nd hand Hammerli 480 (non-K version!). All due to my inexperience and exuberance to get a PCP -I didn't know any better! But because I waited and had the chance to shoot a dozen matches, pick the brains of decades-long shooters, hold and dry-fire a dozen different pistols, I'm now on a waiting list for the pistol that's right for me and won't gather dust in a closet after the other 'fun' has gone away.

[Richard H]

Are you going to leave us in all that suspense? What pistol pray tell are you on a waiting list for?

[spacestout]

Our state champion in NRA and USAS uses a CO2 LP5 with the brass cylinders. He has an off day periodically, but typically wins the PTO AP match. He's tried to tell me to not be in a hurry to get all the fancy guns. To spend my time learning the fundamentals of shooting. He started in the service with .45's. He learned to hold steady with a heavy trigger, mil-spec grips, and a slight bit of nose rise. I watch him in 3-pistol matches. He seems to do as well with open sights or red dot, fancy grips or not, .22, CF, or .45. He can pick up any gun and excel with it.

Now, after years of shooting, and at least daily dryfire, he's starting to consider some things like slight adjustments to grip. He coaches that most of your score comes from daily practice and being able to squeeze a trigger. He also recognizes that there is continual room for improvement in this sport, and that a pistol set up for your uniqueness can add points.

I won't disagree with any post above. Everyone has a unique and valuable perspective.

I see value in training with heavy triggers and heavy guns. Sort of like when I played baseball. We'd put a heavy donut on the bat in the hole. Then we could swing faster at bat. In track we'd sprint up hill or with army boots. For basketball I had to knock off the power lifting or I'd lose my shooting touch.

And thus we untimately need to train with our competition firearm because good scores correlate with repeatibility.

That said, I'm attracted to the PCPs because they are neat. I've always been a sucker for precision instruments.

[_Axel_]

If you cant try alot of guns, get the one that has the most adjustments. An resale value would be important too! Pll spend years learning what really suits them...

[Guest]

Are you going to leave us in all that suspense? What pistol pray tell are you on a waiting list for?

He's stepping up from an IZH 46 to an IZH 46M

*snicker*

[mmxx100]

Are you going to leave us in all that suspense? What pistol pray tell are you on a waiting list for?

Its Pardini K2S, which i used for 6months and scored 570+ which i borrowed from one of my teammate. Here in our club there is only one pistol thts steyr lp10, which i didnt find comfortable for (may be because it is used by 12shooters in our club) me. Pardini K2S seemed pretty gud for me.

Actually the question i asked is not really for me, its for one of my friend who used clubs styer lp10 and i asked him for getting a Pardini K10. He waned to know which is the best weapon, i already told him all the pistols are fine, it all depends upon individual whichone is suitable for him.

Now i think he has got the answer..

[deadeyedick]

Joined: 01 Mar 2004
Posts: 1574
Location: Guelph, Ontario
Posted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:31 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A club pistol, don't know what model but is for the most part its irreleva

Let me get this straight........this guy shoots 580+ in 60 shot 10m. air pistol, using a club pistol, and needs advice as to what pistol to buy ?

This may seem sceptical, but 580 is an olympic score [ I think 583 won the bronze in 2004 ] this seems a litttle far fetched to me, but I guess anything is possible. Are there any others with feelings such as mine ? ....don't be offended mmxx100, but this story has me reeling a little.

[Muffo]

I havent followed this cloesly but i thought the person who shot the good scores asked the question for some1 else. I thought he said he had shot 570 plus. If he said he shot 589 then im with you

[Seamaster]

There are so many crouching tigers and hidden dragons in this forum, who claimed shooting in the 570, 580's.

For crying out loud, the MQS (minimum qualifying score) for Olympics is 563.

580's you will be in the finals of Olympics !!

Are there really that many crouching tiger/tigress and hidden dragon/dragon ladies in this forum?

[guests]

Seamaster and All:

There is a *huge* difference between shooting a 586 one time at a PTO match . . . and shooting 586 over and over again including team qualifiers, world cups, and at the "Big Show."

There are probably several folks in this forum who have shot a 580+ once . . . or twice . . . but maybe not when it really mattered.

Steve Swartz

[jipe]

There are so many crouching tigers and hidden dragons in this forum, who claimed shooting in the 570, 580's.

For crying out loud, the MQS (minimum qualifying score) for Olympics is 563.

Where are you from ? In my country, its 571 for 10m AP men for OG, WChamp and WCup (in 2010, 2011 = 572, 2012 = 573 = next OG). 563 is for junior men.

[deadeyedick]

Seamaster and All:

There is a *huge* difference between shooting a 586 one time at a PTO match . . . and shooting 586 over and over again including team qualifiers, world cups, and at the "Big Show."

There are probably several folks in this forum who have shot a 580+ once . . . or twice . . . but maybe not when it really mattered.

Steve Swartz

Then there is still hope for me yet....thanks Steve.

[Spencer]

There are so many crouching tigers and hidden dragons in this forum, who claimed shooting in the 570, 580's.

For crying out loud, the MQS (minimum qualifying score) for Olympics is 563.

Where are you from ? In my country, its 571 for 10m AP men for OG, WChamp and WCup (in 2010, 2011 = 572, 2012 = 573 = next OG). 563 is for junior men.

Perhaps you are confusing your NF's requirements with ISSF/IOC MQS. MQS for 2008 was:
Q.3.3.1 Events for Men
50 m Pistol Men 540
25 m Rapid Fire Pistol Men 573
10 m Air Pistol Men 563

From the 2009/1 rules
These Special Regulations are in the process of agreement with the IOC for the London Olympic Games and will be published separately as soon as
possible.

[guests]

Deadeye:

That's what keeps me plugging away . . . every once in a while I get a "tailwind" on a downhill slope with the sun at my back and the bluebird of happiness singing in my ears . . . magic happens . . . and then the next time, reality hits!

"Theres the rub" as they say. If I could only make those really really good days happen *all the time* well then, I'd be set!

Steve Swartz

[that's why I am so obsessive and "anal" about focusing on refining the PROCESS of delivering the shot. If I can get the PROCESS knocked, the outcomes should begin to fall in place. However, part of hte human condition is that thinking about the PROCESS is hard! We would all much rather skip that whole process part and just concentrate on results!]

[Shine]

They are all good pistols, I have owned and shot LP1,LP10 and Morini, it is a matter of preference. I now shoot the FWB P44, the pistol is light, balance and stable and I am old which makes it the perfect pistol for me.